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Old October 5th, 2005, 03:46 PM   #11
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Default Re: Evolutionary psychology: -Rone men and -None Men

Drives a lot of specific attraction - sexual. Very direct, sexual attraction.

The way androstenone can make senior women bobble around unformfortably can be downright disturbing, depending on their style of bobbling!

There's lots of ways to be sexual as a "side-effect" (in reality, there are no side effects, just effects - "side" and "primary" are more of a function of the observer).

That's why rone can be sexual.

Heck, dinner can be sexual for many. Tending to a lady's survival and making it pleasant in the process can bring out some very strong impulses. That's part of the reason why someone to dinner why this is staple of all dates, and business interactions.

-None is almost the equivolent of a woman stuffinf their bra... it's like you're putting socks in your muscles, and in the front pocket of your pants.

Yes, if -none makes some people who wear it aggressive. This often works out to be a good thing. When it makes the meek fierce, they are congruent.

I always wear -none on my neck/chest, or even a little on my face for this effect. I don't want it on my wrists so much, where it'll be exposed widely to everyone but me.

PI... what's the mcg per drop on that? If I can remember correctly it's way too high. When I've played with that in the past, I didn't like the effects. It's an instant- OD product, which is not a good thing with androstenone .

You can just use some Turn Up the Heat M1 (Mix 1). We have 5mcg per spray. Even that will too much for some, though, I realize. Nonetheless, it's massively useful having dosed products. I think we also have Pure None ("black label" none), Raw Power (raw, unscented -none), Dirty (-none plus sex/social proof) and some other primarily -none based products in prerelease... all dosed.

If NPA worked well with my body chemistry, that would be the only product I'd actively use outside of my own. There's one effect it produces that I really like, but it tends to make me overly aggressive, and produce positive effects only crowds I'm not looking to affect. I've actually recommended it to others, especially 50 and up. I think they should produce more products.

Oops - I just misspoke. I really love Pheros, and it's completely unique. I wish it's creator would make more products, as well. Then again, it's really more like a work of art, than a product! After I get this company kicking faster after some dramatic internal changes, I'd love to commission something from him (if he does that).

Dodd, too, I'd love to commission him. The downside is that he may have too much money from the sales of Kiotech to care.

How much -none are you using in your mixes? Do you even know?
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Old October 6th, 2005, 03:53 AM   #12
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Default Re: Evolutionary psychology: -Rone men and -None Men

I believe one drop of PI -none is .025mg. Two dabs of NPA is .024 none plus secret ingredient roughly, I believe.

I've had reactions from NPA or TE like you wouldn't believe but due to an inconsistent delivery method, it's hard to hit that perfect dosage window that ends up working. Dispersal issues come into play too into getting into that zone.

I like Androtics approach becuse of the consistency with regard to delivery.

None actually makes me anti-social and has a bad effect on me, btw. I'm positive the attraction has nothing to do with how I look or the body language I give off, it's basically tapping into something automatic that pheromones can cause on a biochemical level. But it's hard to hit that point. None (and the secret ingredient) is particuarly precise, and mastering it is elusive.

I think it'd be great if you could work with Lacroy, as their phero content is special. Unfortunately, I'm not sure there existing relationship with others would allow that. Perhaps there's a way though.
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Old October 6th, 2005, 07:45 AM   #13
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Default Re: Evolutionary psychology: -Rone men and -None Men

Quote:
Originally Posted by Futurist
I believe one drop of PI -none is .025mg. Two dabs of NPA is .024 none plus secret ingredient roughly, I believe..
I thought PI was even higher than that?

When I tried PI in the past, I never had good effects. Worse, their suggestions in their copy to use such a high concentration androstenone product at work I think is, at best, irresponsible.

If it is actually 25mcg per drop, however, I can see how it'd be perfect for a man in his 70s, who has almost no pheromone output of his own.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Futurist
I've had reactions from NPA or TE like you wouldn't believe but due to an inconsistent delivery method, it's hard to hit that perfect dosage window that ends up working. Dispersal issues come into play too into getting into that zone.

I like Androtics approach becuse of the consistency with regard to delivery.

None actually makes me anti-social and has a bad effect on me, btw. I'm positive the attraction has nothing to do with how I look or the body language I give off, it's basically tapping into something automatic that pheromones can cause on a biochemical level. But it's hard to hit that point. None (and the secret ingredient) is particuarly precise, and mastering it is elusive.
TE/NPA definitely has something interesting going on.

Thanks for your nice comments, btw.

If you've never heard -- that was a major reason behind founding Androtics. I had a pheromone hobby which was a rapidly becoming an annoyance, because nobody cared about dosing or mixability issues, or a lot of practical "little things".

Hobbies should be fun and exciting, not annoying.

I think it's ludicrous that we basically "invented" dosed pheromes in the commercial market, came out with the first doses products. What a stupid thing to have to "invent" (or apply, really)! Seriously...

Makes me wonder how passionate some other formulators are about using their own products. Do you think most pheromone products creators even use their own products? If they don't, why/how did they make them? Just another job?

I don't like that system.

On the other hand, I think anybody who's passionate about something, and makes products that they themselves can use and enjoy, ends up making some of the better products on the market.

Personally, I'm still not completely satisfied with what I can offer myself, but I'm getting there... and the process will help the market. The unfortunate side effect, though, is that I'm constantly overexposed to pheromones, so it's tough to test these things out myself sometimes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Futurist
I think it'd be great if you could work with Lacroy, as their phero content is special. Unfortunately, I'm not sure there existing relationship with others would allow that. Perhaps there's a way though.
I wouldn't mind working with Daryn, George Dodd, or Winifred Cutler. Anybody who does (or did) good work, I'll work with.

We all work together, anyway, whether we talk to each other or not. Honest competition is a form of cooperation, after all.
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Old October 7th, 2005, 02:25 AM   #14
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Default Re: Evolutionary psychology: -Rone men and -None Men

Quote:
Originally Posted by MHarris
I thought PI was even higher than that?

When I tried PI in the past, I never had good effects. Worse, their suggestions in their copy to use such a high concentration androstenone product at work I think is, at best, irresponsible.

If it is actually 25mcg per drop, however, I can see how it'd be perfect for a man in his 70s, who has almost no pheromone output of his own.
Very irresponsible. These are people's lives we're talking about.


I've never had good effects myself.



Quote:

If you've never heard -- that was a major reason behind founding Androtics. I had a pheromone hobby which was a rapidly becoming an annoyance, because nobody cared about dosing or mixability issues, or a lot of practical "little things".

Hobbies should be fun and exciting, not annoying.

I think it's ludicrous that we basically "invented" dosed pheromes in the commercial market, came out with the first doses products. What a stupid thing to have to "invent" (or apply, really)! Seriously...

Makes me wonder how passionate some other formulators are about using their own products. Do you think most pheromone products creators even use their own products? If they don't, why/how did they make them? Just another job?

As Jasmin knows, I too have had plenty of complaints about the suppliers out there. It's a joke in some respects how little the formulators use this stuff or even know. I've heard some formulators tell me about their process of determining their ratios and it amounts to a few nights at a bar. And, yes, many of the major players don't use their own products, or worse off, try other products. THe formulor of one best seller hasn't even ever tried none.

Then, when you get instant ODs on the default delivery method, it just shows how much they care. Many of the times not even instructions or warnings.


Quote:


I wouldn't mind working with Daryn, George Dodd, or Winifred Cutler. Anybody who does (or did) good work, I'll work with.
Seems like it's a side thing for Lacroy, but they have something great already, that needs to be completed with pheromones you have.
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Old October 8th, 2005, 11:33 PM   #15
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Default Re: Evolutionary psychology: -Rone men and -None Men

Quote:
Originally Posted by MHarris

If it is actually 25mcg per drop, however, I can see how it'd be perfect for a man in his 70s, who has almost no pheromone output of his own.
I am 42 years and I would like to have a more alpha aurea, i'm such tipe of man with more Rone than none.

You said 25mcg is too much for young men.... I usually place 50% of ` mones on my clothes and 50% on my skin. I have had sometimes problems with other men (friends of mine) I think because I had too much nones (but fine with women).

What you think should be the maximum dose of NONE for me ? (I am only concerned with nones due to I have understood NOL and A1 has not risk of overdose ; I always do mix A1 with a314 or npa or another formulation with nones)
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Old October 13th, 2005, 08:06 AM   #16
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Default Re: Evolutionary psychology: -Rone men and -None Men

Quote:
Originally Posted by Futurist
Very irresponsible. These are people's lives we're talking about.


I've never had good effects myself.





As Jasmin knows, I too have had plenty of complaints about the suppliers out there. It's a joke in some respects how little the formulators use this stuff or even know. I've heard some formulators tell me about their process of determining their ratios and it amounts to a few nights at a bar. And, yes, many of the major players don't use their own products, or worse off, try other products. THe formulor of one best seller hasn't even ever tried none.

Then, when you get instant ODs on the default delivery method, it just shows how much they care. Many of the times not even instructions or warnings.




Seems like it's a side thing for Lacroy, but they have something great already, that needs to be completed with pheromones you have.
Yeah, it is very irresponsible, when it comes to -none. At least give the proper instructions and/or ad copy.

I'm actually toying labeling one of my high -none mixes "Instant Jerk", because you know what? That's exactly what you become, and the vibe you give off when you use it.

Why not just be honest? Steer people to want they want. It hit me that, hey... some guys would die to a give off a jerk vibe, if they've lived their entire life as a nice guy. Not so appealing to me, but hey...

I've been out of the loop for awhile, too busy... but yes, some of the formulation leaves a lot to be desired. I constantly make new mixes for my first and primary guinea pig - myself. But I also put out mixes in groups, too.

I don't like doing complex mixes anymore. I really want to put the tools out there for people to make their own complex mixes.

It's you're coated in blue paint, I'm coaed in yellow paint, and for a nice night out, we want to be painted red. Well, we both have to add very different colors to make red, don't we?
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Old October 13th, 2005, 08:10 AM   #17
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Default Re: Evolutionary psychology: -Rone men and -None Men

Quote:
Originally Posted by nadero
I am 42 years and I would like to have a more alpha aurea, i'm such tipe of man with more Rone than none.

You said 25mcg is too much for young men.... I usually place 50% of ` mones on my clothes and 50% on my skin. I have had sometimes problems with other men (friends of mine) I think because I had too much nones (but fine with women).

What you think should be the maximum dose of NONE for me ? (I am only concerned with nones due to I have understood NOL and A1 has not risk of overdose; I always do mix A1 with a314 or npa or another formulation with nones)
Even 1mcg of none can make a difference. It depends on what you need, and the kind of people you're trying to impact.

-None will cause fighting or aversion amongst your male friends. That's the downside you're going to have to live with if you like raw sexual effets, although A314 and androstadienone do indeed ameliorate that effect.

Max dose is around 20.

Just trying different amounts every day, everything from 1 to 20.

Ideal daily dose for me is 3-6mcg. Ideal night club dose, 5-20, it really depends. If I already feel very "edgy" or that, or if I've been moody, I go with less. If I'm been very peaceful, and I want to hit a bar, I'll do 10 to 20, and I'll apply mostly to my chest, so it affects me, too.
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Old October 14th, 2005, 08:24 PM   #18
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Default Re: Evolutionary psychology: -Rone men and -None Men

Quote:
Originally Posted by MHarris
Max dose is around 20.

Just trying different amounts every day, everything from 1 to 20.

Ideal daily dose for me is 3-6mcg. Ideal night club dose, 5-20
What do you think about putting mones on clothes? I have understood that - mones on clothes should be less volatile, so dosage should be greater than on skin.

As I usually apply 50% of - mones on my clothes, and the other 50% on my chest and behind ears, I suppose I could use more than 20mcg of none, maybe max 30mcg of none.
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Old October 14th, 2005, 09:50 PM   #19
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Default Re: Evolutionary psychology: -Rone men and -None Men

Quote:
Originally Posted by nadero
What do you think about putting mones on clothes? I have understood that - mones on clothes should be less volatile, so dosage should be greater than on skin.

As I usually apply 50% of -mones on my clothes, and the other 50% on my chest and behind ears, I suppose I could use more than 20mcg of none, maybe max 30mcg of none.
I don't like pheromones on clothes very much, because they're hard to remove from fibers, and, yes, there's volatility issues.

Pheromones on clothes are kind of like cologne on clothes.

Old girlfriends will often keep one of your tshirts that smells like your bodily sweat or your cologne, whether they tell you or not. If a t-shirt goes missing, connect the dots. Think about it. Ex-girlfriends are the #1 "t-shirt" faeries.

Thing is, does that t-shirt really diffuse? The girl can mostly smell it when she snuggles with it very close to her, which is the purpose she keeps it for. As a warm reminder of you, the equivolent of a grown up's teddy bear or a comforting pillow between her legs.

Spray some cologne onto a t-shirt, and experiment with how well it diffuses.

Keep in mind that commercial cologne houses that diffusion down to a science (and yet they still don't diffuse really well from clothing). I know a little bit you of that science now, but you really get NONE of that diffusion science going for you when you use unscented pheromones.

In terms of fragrance science, pheromone molecules are HEAVY, with the molecular weight of other base notes.

When I want to minimize conversions and get a clothing-like effect, I apply to the hair on my head. I like spraying androstenol onto my hair. The heat from my head rises up, and pushes the pheromone out.

Women naturally use their hair to flick pheromones at you. A typical thing women do when they're attracted to you is the "hair flip". That's fairly well known.

What's not as well known, is that the nape of the neck - an eroticized part of the body in many cultures (especially Japan) - actually puts emits many pheromones. So the scientific reason women are flipping ther hair at you is to send you put you downstream to a strong, personal gust of their pheromones.

I like the hair, and you can wash the hair. Products like Nioxin and other polysorbate based hair cleaners are good at removing pheromonal content, allowing you to "start from scratch".

I'm not saying that clothing application is bad, it just has it's issues.

Like it or not, we're still at the very beginning of pheromone technology. It's very much the realm of Lewis & Clark. We're like pheromone adventurers.

With that "pioneering" spirit in mind, applying to your clothing is much more commital than I personally prefer. When I have my way about it, I like to try new mixes each day, sometimes several times a day. I wouldn't be able to do that with clothing.

...

On another note entirely, why do you suppose you could increase to 30mcg none? Because of the lower diffusion on clothing?

That may be true.

One positive to the lower diffusion of clothing. Provided that you don't have excess buildup, the pheromone source will be truly 'localized'. If you OD on the skin or hair, the pheromones tend to go everywhere, in part because of your body heat. With those ODs, the brain has trouble deciding who's emiting. ODs on a non-diffusive substance would be quite localized and readily 'located'.

Last edited by MHarris; October 14th, 2005 at 09:58 PM.
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Old November 8th, 2005, 10:33 PM   #20
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Default Re: Evolutionary psychology: -Rone men and -None Men

even though i've been using pheromone products for about 5 years now, i've only just recently realized the experimental possibilities/potential.

i wanted to do a clothing test, so about three weeks ago i took a hooded sweatshirt that i wear to the gym and a bottle containing a mix of 5 parts none 1 part rone and tipped the bottle directly onto the sweatshirt, once at each shoulder. didn't use a finger to dab or a sprayer, just tipped the bottle directly onto the fabric and immediately removed.

none only gives off a "lab" smell to me, can't detect the cat piss smell that others get, but 3 weeks later i still can detect the none/rone mix.

if i tried wearing that sweatshirt on the same day i used something like NPA on my chest/ears/wrists etc i can only imagine an OD as a result.

this forum appears to still be in its infancy, but seems to have more relevant information per post than others i have seen.
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